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President Kagame pleased with relations with South Africa, urges DRC not to 'squander' Inter-Congolese Dialogue

Following talks with President Thabo MBEKI in Cape Town, South Africa on Thursday 14th March 2002, President KAGAME spoke to SABC about Rwanda-South Africa relations, the Inter-Congolese Dialogue, the future of the Lusaka peace process, reconciliation in Rwanda and constitution making process
Excerpts below:

Question: Mr. President, can you start by telling us what it is that you discussed today with President Mbeki?


PRESIDENT KAGAME:
Our discussions covered a wide range of issues, but mainly focused on our bilateral relations, which are good but we want to ensure that our people benefit fully from the good relations between our countries. We also discussed issues relating to peace and stability in the Great Lakes region. On this issue, South Africa and President Mbeki in particular have played a big positive role, so we had plenty to discuss there.
We also discussed the New Partnership for Africa's Development. President Mbeki has been very central in itsdevelopment. We are looking at how we can work together on the entire continent to have Africa's development agenda pushed forward.

Question: Turning to the Congo Mr. President, now that the UN has sent troops to the DRC in accord with the Lusaka protocol, why do you still have troops there?


PRESIDENT KAGAME:
We still have troops in the DRC because the UN forces are not there to take care of our concerns. Our concerns are to do with security. You should remember that we had a Genocide in Rwanda. Those forces that were responsible for the Genocide fled to Congo. At that time Mobutu was in power and he came in to help them to cause insecurity across the border in Rwanda. After Mobutu was overthrown, Laurent and Joseph Kabila also started associating themselves with the same militia groups who continue to cause problems for us across the border.
Our sending troops into Congo in 1996 and 1998 was to deal with these forces that were associated with the Genocide in Rwanda and wanted to continue causing problems for us.
The presence of the UN in the DRC does not address that problem. We continue to find ourselves having to address the problems ourselves.

Question: Rwanda is a very small country with limited resources, yet you have thousands of troops in the DRC. How do you manage to finance the war with such limited resources?


PRESIDENT KAGAME:
The greatest resource we have in Rwanda is our people. That is why we value human life. The lives of our people are very precious, and that is why guaranteeing their security and peace is of paramount importance. We cannot afford to have our people dying at the hands of militia groups.
Fighting a war is not only a question of finances. It is also a question of commitment, sacrifice. Before the 1994 Genocide, some of us were involved in an armed struggle, fighting for the liberation of our country for four years without pay. The issue is not simply one of money, it is about the justness of your cause, your rights, freedom, and ultimately life itself.

Question: Do you have any faith in the talks that are taking place among the Congolese political groups in Sun City?

I believe that it is really up to the Congolese people to understand that they have very serious problems that they should address and find solutions to. The primary responsibility lies with the people of Congo. They have very serious problems. They need to address their internal problems and also address the security concerns of their neighbours. They need to bring their country back together instead of having it divided under different factions. Their people have been suffering. They need to find solutions that will lead to a brighter future for their people and the region as a whole. We believe that the Inter-Congolese Dialogue is an opportunity the people of Congo cannot afford to squander.



Question: How is the reconciliation process progressing in Rwanda?

PRESIDENT KAGAME:
The reconciliation process is progressing well. We have had much success in bridging the gaps that have existed in our society. The country is peaceful and stable. The people are living and working well together, trying to overcome the tragic events of 1994 and the whole history that led up to it.
Looking at the way things are today, one can really say that in eight years we have made tremendous progress.

Question: You are planning to try over 100,000 people suspected of participating in the Genocide. What sort of justice are we looking at here?

PRESIDENT KAGAME:
Let me take you through some facts first. We have established as a fact, through a census of those that died in the Genocide, that we lost over one million people. They died at the hands of those who planned, organized and executed the Genocide. So Genocide did take place in Rwanda, that is a fact not a mere allegation. The one million people did not die in an earthquake, floods or other natural disaster. They were killed in a Genocide.
We are still trying to overcome that situation, but I think progress has been made as I mentioned earlier.
The one hundred thousand Genocide suspects must be tried in some way. We found that using the classical justice system would take too long, in which case we would not realize an end to the problem soon.
We had to find other ways of doing it. We improvised with what we call 'Gacaca', which is a traditional community justice system where people of integrity in the community meet to hear and pass judgement on cases and resolve disputes. This system had been working for several decades, centuries perhaps, in our society. The community courts would listen to cases and not only give punishment, but sometimes also forgive and reconcile those who have greviances. We have been working to fuse this traditional method with the classical justice system, with the view to achieving two things; on the one hand to achieve reconciliation and on the other hand to speed up the trials of the suspects.

Question: Elections are planned in Rwanda soon. What sort of election are you looking at having? Are we looking at multi-party elections, even after the Genocide?

PRESIDENT KAGAME:
Rwanda actually already has a multi-party system of government. There are eight political parties in parliament, five of which are represented in Government.
We have a constitution-making process which is on-going and is taking into account our troubled history, including the actual political complications that led to the Genocide. The constitution making process will continue through this whole year and early next year if necessary. We think that after that, we shall begin heading towards multi-party elections, at the Parliamentary and Presidential levels.
The constitution making process will provide rules that govern political parties. This is necessary because of our tragic history. We are mindful of the fact that we cannot allow any kind of politics, especially divisive politics.
The issue is not whether we shall have several parties operating in the country, because we have that already. Rather, the issue is how they can operate without plunging the country into sectarianism and another cycle of Genocide.

© The Government of Rwanda.